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Mooresy
United Kingdom
161 Posts |
 Posted - 17 Oct 2013 : 16:02:28
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I know its an old thread but I had the same problem with my Rapier over 20 years ago. The problem is if the tank has been left empty or with very little fuel in. The coating on the inside of the tank 'drys out' when fuel is reintroduced the dry coating takes in the solvents in the fuel and starts to lift. It tried everything at the time (I remember an AA patrolman telling me this info and saying it was a big problem with hillman hunters and avengers) I tried constantly flushing the tank with fuel agitated with nuts and bolts (as mentioned). Once left a few weeks the problem returned as more paint flaked off.
Now, here's how to kind of fix the problem. the fuel line exits from the bottom of the tank via a coupling located in a threaded low point or sump. this, by nature, collects all the flaked paint and does a good job of gathering all the particles in the tank ready for there route to the fuel pump. some flakes can be that big they will actually block the pipe at the tank end. This can be temporarily fixed by un-attaching the fuel line at the pump and blowing back down it. For a more permanent fix, get a small length of tube and insert it into the metal tank union, so the tube sticks up about 10mm into the tank. drill a few small holes in it and make sure the tube is a tight fit in the union. Next fit an in-line fuel filter (a largish one). After doing this I never had the problem again. Just worth giving your tank a flush ever 12 months and changing the filter. Sure, the tank still flakes but now it stays away from your pump and carbs. |
Edited by - Mooresy on 17 Oct 2013 16:09:06 |
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puffin
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2013 : 22:46:50
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Hi Guys,
Took Phoebe to a Rolling Road near me (Launceston) and got very interesting results. Mark told me that in spite of the carbs being absolutely to spec and fully cleaned etc, she was running very lean. He changed main jets, pump jets and tweaked the air correctors- result - she now runs very nicely indeed. He also said that from work he has done on other H120s, he feels the original air filter set-up is very restrictive- and draws hot air from near the manifold. Now getting 80-90bhp at the wheels which I guess is about 110 at the flywheel. Sounds about right, and certainly feels good on the road!
ATB
David |
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puffin
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2013 : 21:52:15
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Good point Janmarine3,and I think i've got an old Facet somewhere. But if it is tank partial vacuum causing the problem, it may take a while to build up some suction...! Anyway, I'll get the tasnk out and the fuel line off for a good inspection on general principles. After all, everything is 40+ years old, si I wouldn't be surprised at some deterioration in the tank lining/fuel pipe...
ATB
David |
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janmarine3
South Africa
286 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2013 : 11:19:24
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| Might be worth it to make sure the mechanical fuel system is ok by borrowing an electric fuel pump and installing it temporally and feeding it with a 2 litre bottle or similar - see how it runs ? |
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bigt80
United Kingdom
1052 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2013 : 00:58:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Fastback Thomas
It will work Glen, don't know about the cementmixer, but cleaning it with nuts and blots etc. inside really helps.
We did it with a set of a sunbeam alpine (no baffles) tanks and we could really see the flakes coming out when we emptied it... we did use little stones...
We also partially did my tank while we were at it and although the baffles might be in the way it works, you might have to hold it in a certain position to get the stones past the next baffle but it will work.
Afterwords we got an epoxy sealer that was specially made for these applicatons and coated the inside of the tanks car still drives great without any problem!
Hope you get it fixed David!
Good luck, Thomas
'68 sunbeam rapier fastback {B341006846 OD/LHO}
I like a car that looks normal but really knocks your socks off!!
Yes, I was sceptical, but hearing from someone else that it works; well, I'll go for that. Might be something I need to do on the kack-hander, but I hope not. Running OK at the mo. except for too rich due to seals in carbs that need to be replaced. Will update on that thread in due course. Cheers. G. |
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Fastback Thomas
Belgium
423 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2013 : 09:19:13
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It will work Glen, don't know about the cementmixer, but cleaning it with nuts and blots etc. inside really helps.
We did it with a set of a sunbeam alpine (no baffles) tanks and we could really see the flakes coming out when we emptied it... we did use little stones...
We also partially did my tank while we were at it and although the baffles might be in the way it works, you might have to hold it in a certain position to get the stones past the next baffle but it will work.
Afterwords we got an epoxy sealer that was specially made for these applicatons and coated the inside of the tanks car still drives great without any problem!
Hope you get it fixed David!
Good luck, Thomas
'68 sunbeam rapier fastback {B341006846 OD/LHO}
I like a car that looks normal but really knocks your socks off!!
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bigt80
United Kingdom
1052 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2013 : 19:35:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Jon
Its to do with the inside of your tank coming away and ending up in the fuel line/pump from my experiance. Rootes group painted all the insides of the tank! If you have the glass bowel fuel pump take the bowl off and have a look inside the pump.
Worked great with the old four star fuel but not the new unleaded with more methanol than ever! It works like paint stripper I had a load of trouble with my rapier,my commer van,my avenger and my friend who also has lots of rootes vehicles also having the same problem.
Yes, a general problem for older motors now that the meth. content is higher; some gasket sealants that were impervious to petrol; are no longer. Also if breather not working properly it can allow build up of condensation when car laid up for long time & result in same problem. Once that inner coating starts to flake off there isn't much you can do. Not sure if the cement mixer and nuts will work as with all the baffles inside I don't know if it would get to work on the whole of the inside. Not sure either if slosh sealant is still around and if it is how effective it is. All in all a right pain  |
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puffin
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 02 May 2013 : 21:54:22
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Well,
it seems clear I need a good look inside the tank,so I might as well take it out while I'm doing everything else- it looks like a straightforward job (famous last words).
ATB
David |
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arrocuda
United Kingdom
501 Posts |
Posted - 01 May 2013 : 07:54:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Jon
Another way is remove your tank,chuck a hand full of nuts and bolts in,strap it to a cement mixer and leave it goin for a few hours!
Building the 'Mark II' fastback Rapier ('Arrocuda'). |
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Jon
United Kingdom
221 Posts |
Posted - 29 Apr 2013 : 23:13:17
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Its to do with the inside of your tank coming away and ending up in the fuel line/pump from my experiance. Rootes group painted all the insides of the tank! If you have the glass bowel fuel pump take the bowl off and have a look inside the pump.
Worked great with the old four star fuel but not the new unleaded with more methanol than ever! It works like paint stripper I had a load of trouble with my rapier,my commer van,my avenger and my friend who also has lots of rootes vehicles also having the same problem. Ive now fitted a custom made ally fuel tank to my commer its now sorted Another way is remove your tank,chuck a hand full of nuts and bolts in,strap it to a cement mixer and leave it goin for a few hours! Soon strips it all off to nice shiney metal
Hillman Avenger MK1 GT,
Commer PB Pick-Up,
Commer PB Panel Van,
Commer Auto sleeper,
Triumph Stag MK1,
Chevette HS x2,
Lancia Delta Integrale,
Fiat Mk1 Uno Turbo,
Rapier Fastback,
MGZS 180kit TD MK2,
MK5 Transit Hallmark 1965-95 celebration,
MK5 Transit 2.5td 150,
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puffin
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 29 Apr 2013 : 21:58:19
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Hi there,
Yes, I'm very pleased with her- hope to get to Malcolm's events, as he's just sent me the list for 2013. However, I do have a little bit of a problem with hot starting and a 2000rpm misfire. I'm as sure as I can be that it's not ignition- I've just fitted luminition, red rotor arm and new plugs/HT leads and dizzy cap, so I think it's a fuel supply problem. I've stripped both carbs and checked jets etc, new needle valve/floats etc, and I noticed when she was good and hot that there were lots of bubbles coming up from the fuel pump. I'd already fitted a new diaphragm and the presure was 3.5-4 psi which is spot on, so I think what I have is a partial vacuum developing in the fuel tank, and /or an air leak into the fuel pipe somewhere between the tank and the pump. This would explain the symptoms which are effectively partial fuel starvation, made worse by high underbonnet temps causing some vapour lock. SO...I'm going to clear the filler cap vent or make another one, replace the old fuel pipe with 8mm Kunifer, fit a 10 psi electric fuel pump and a Filter King filter right by the carbs (to drop the pressure back down). I came up with this solution after reading all the all the tech forum stuff and chewing it over with Rob at Eurocarb. Have you ever had any problems like this? People seem to be saying it's down to unleaded fuel, but I'm adding Tetraboost to mine (TetraEthylLead), which should make it identical to the old 4 star... I don't know, it's all a bit of a puzzle wrapped in an enigma etc...
ATB
for now,
David |
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JPSH120
United Kingdom
1180 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2013 : 22:18:47
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Very nice and the colour looks good too. I hope to meet you over the next few months, are you planning to attend any of Malcolms events?
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puffin
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2013 : 21:49:14
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I've worked out how to do it via Photoshop- now completely ***ckered, so going to have a drink...
ATB
David |
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puffin
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2013 : 20:54:21
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Hi Glen,
Didn't I send you pics of the car? If I did, can you upload- if I didn't, can I e-mail them to you??
ATB
David |
Edited by - puffin on 28 Apr 2013 20:59:29 |
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bigt80
United Kingdom
1052 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2013 : 20:40:33
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That's fine looking Rapier, even in poor res. Wonder what happened to that  |
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Topic |
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New H120 owner/member- well, sort of...
